How do you manage your sourdough starter?

Kevin Olson wrote:I have very limited experience, but will watch this thread to learn from those who are "in the know".

When I was baking sourdough regularly, I kept a small starter in the fridge, and baked about once per week, expanding the starter in several feedings or stages (not sure those are the right words - I am usually rather prolix. but just don't remember all of the right words - levain, preferment, poolish, sponge, biga, etc.; they're all mixed up in my head).  This was a high hydration starter, using store bought King Arthur white (but unbleached) bread flour, mostly.  But, I have been "off the sauce" for a while (trying to reduce useless carbohydrate intake in my diet), to deal with some health issues.

I now have a new-to-me Retsel grain mill, and have just started making whole meal bread again (first loaf last week - edible, but very dense).  I am slowly experimenting with adding high fiber carbohydrates, including whole meal bread, back into my diet.  I think I could fit something like the Laurel's Kitchen desem into my life, though getting the starter going by her recipe is pretty extravagant (10 lbs of flour?  really?  it took 40 minutes to hand grind 500 grams!  I don't probably need to grind that fine, but wow!  Just, wow!).

So, very happy to lurk and learn from you all!

Kate Downham wrote:I have the retsel mill as well, I only use it when we don't have enough solar to power the electric mill. To produce flour more quickly I mill on a slightly course setting. I find that wheat is the easiest of the gluten-containing grains to mill on it. If I make pan loaves and keep the hydration of the recipe above around 84%, I can get decent bread from course-milled wheat - not as good as fine-milled, but I don't have time to mill finely on the Retsel so it's better than nothing. The wheat we get here is a kind of hard wheat, but not a red one, I know some red ones can have really hard bran, so it might be worth tracking down some hard white wheat and seeing how that mills, it might be a bit quicker.

Kevin Olson wrote:I tried 80% hydration by weight for this batch.  I never got really good gluten development - at least I think that's true, because, it was kind of "shaggy" and sticky, not ever becoming smooth as I'd expect.  This was with multiple kneading and resting sessions, and a temperature controlled proofing box.

Kate Downham wrote:... I am usually making a levain/preferment, so I mix it up in my mixing bowl and leave it covered with a tea towel...

Rebecca Norman wrote:Hi Kevin! I used to knead a lot, thinking it was necessary for gluten development. But in recent years a close friend convinced me to try the no-knead method, and wow, it results in much better gluten development and crumb structure! Like, MUCH better. Consider giving it a try.

Lif Strand wrote:

Kate Downham wrote:... I am usually making a levain/preferment, so I mix it up in my mixing bowl and leave it covered with a tea towel...

Could you talk more about your levain/preferment? Are you using 1:1 ratio to feed? What happens if you aren't going to bake for a few days?
Thank you!

Kevin Olson wrote:
My daughter has been making bread with home ground, but mixed 50/50 with King Arthur white bread flour, which by inspection behaves entirely differently from my 100% whole meal dough.  We went to visit her and her husband over Easter, and I got to help her when she made their sandwich bread for the week (she's recovering from a broken leg, so I really was able to help, even if mostly as a "gopher").  Her dough was far more manageable than what I've made, but she was starting with a different wheat; and doing the 50/50 flour mix; and using sugar to get her yeast "working"; and added boiling water to some of the whole meal flour (I'd guess to promote gelatinization of the starch, but she didn't know why - that's just how she learned to do it from her friend); and a bunch of other differences from what I've been doing.  That's pretty much the only in person bread making community I have at my disposal, however, at least until my sister is more available.  At the moment, she has too many irons in the fire, and is driving back and forth 8 or so hours each way, in the process of moving back here.  By the end of the summer, she may have time to offer me some gentle guidance and course correction in my efforts.  She'll be running the kitchen for a youth camp this summer, so I know I won't see much of her until that's done.

So all of that to say that your kind advice is much appreciated.

Sandy Kemp wrote:I do it this way. Discard is available for cooking, but no waste.

https://youtu.be/hNCL6jwRJTo?si=DuW1RYPgPnShjtuz

Sandy Kemp wrote:I do it this way. Discard is available for cooking, but no waste.

Sandy Kemp wrote:I do it this way. Discard is available for cooking, but no waste.

Thanks for the link, very interesting video and I am keen to try this for everyday sourdough when I don't want a "holey" artisan loaf. I don't know why I like the holes, but I find the whole structure and mouth feel of a classic sourdough is different to my previously normal, spongy, heavier (failed) sourdough. Maybe this recipe will be a happy medium between lots of effort for a "poor" loaf and give a lighter result. I think I will try it tomorrow and share my results. It might not be as perfect as his as I know my hydration levels are lower than standard 100% it sounds like higher hydration levels are actually the problem-too much liquid to flour ratio.

Kate Downham wrote:Scalding some of the flour in boiling water does a few things:
• Starch gets gelatinised, adding strength to the dough, which is especially helpful if your flour is low in gluten or not ideal for bread.
• Bran gets softened, less ‘tiny knives’ to cut through the gluten strands.
• Brings more hydration into the bread without making the dough too slack to shape - this extra hydration helps it stay fresh for longer.
• Helps create a soft and flexible crumb.

To adapt an existing recipe to use some scalded, flour, use up to 20% of the total flour in the scald, pour over the same weight in water, and then reduce the amount of water in the rest of the recipe by half the amount that you used in the scald (e.g. so if you used 200g of water in the scald, reduce the water in the rest of the recipe by 100g).

Jay Angler wrote:My sourdough starter is rye flour only, which doesn't make great bread, as there's not as much gluten.

My solution is to have a jar just for the starter which we store in the fridge between uses. It is large enough to be able to pour off 1 1/2 cups of starter for a loaf of no-knead bread, and still be viable if we feed it a couple of times over the next 24 hours. (1/4 to 1/2 cup of rye flour and same amount of water for each feeding)

I add another 1 1/2 cups of water to the starter I've removed, and stir that into the dry ingredients which are a mix of unbleached flour, whole wheat flour, rye flour, wheat germ and salt. After it's risen on the counter for 8-12 hours, we pre-heat a glazed cast iron Dutch oven, pour the mix in, and bake.

It's an amazingly easy, no-fuss bread!